☀

[Kapten_Knas]

Ahoy sunshines!

I hope you're all enjoying the summer.
1.13 is slowly creeping upon us and we will of course upgrade when released, therefore I have a few thoughts.

Even though we're quite few casually playing I still want to poll what to do with the map as the release contains fairly large changes towards biomes and generation.

1. The easiest would of course be to nuke the map. Which removes all current content...
   
2. Increasing the mapsize is an alternative option, but I foresee that the old locations on the current map will regardless become obsolete.

In case of a nuke I'm also pondering about minimalizing and whitelisting the server, towards a pretty much pure-vanilla gameplay. Which basically means no teleportation or towns/trading.
Due to the low playerbase and casual gameplay I don't see any point trying to maintain plugins intended for a bit larger crowds.

What are your thoughts?

 

[J1015814]

I think option 1 should be a last resort. If it happens, everyone who's put a lot of time into building something would be discouraged from returning. I see a few ways it could play out:

1) If generation with the same seed simply adds new structures and doesn't change the terrain, it would be best to simply transfer those new things into the old map.

2) If the new map is radically different, it would be easier to transfer old map towns and structures into the new one. This shouldn't be too difficult, so long as elevation and biomes are accounted for.

3) A hybrid solution, wherein large parts of the old map that we don't care about can be completely replaced with new terrain. It would probably be more work than the other options, though.

As for plugins, a lack of protective ones could be disastrous. Anyone who builds more than a dirt hut wants it to be safe from griefing assholes. Even if a rollback could simply undo the damage, in the meantime you'd have a ruined area and basically nothing to build on/toward. With so many Minecraft servers available, those without the patience to deal with preventable shenanigans would leave or never join in the first place. Having only a whitelist won't help much, I'm afraid.

It's worthwhile to start the discussion early, but I'll need to wait and see what develops before making any solid recommendations. It's all speculation at this point.

 

[nsgb]

Hello Knas!

When I moved over to Anembra (when I got tired of the frequent resets of modded Minecraft), I started slowly building but I was burned when the old map was lost. Since then I have had a hard time trusting to commit to the current map... with that I understand that people like to keep the current map, and if I would have spent more than a few hours on the current one so would I.

I do like the idea of pure vanilla with no plugins, one fun thing with the old map was the railroad network, I love these things. Nether hubs and transport systems are also fun to build but they are pointless with teleports. But I agree, griefers are a problem w/o plugins.

Is managing spigot/bukkit plugins time consuming these days? Is it Spigot that you like to avoid? Are you looking for hosted options?

[Är du fortfarande Svensk? Livet rullar på?]

 

[Kapten_Knas]

Ahoy there you two farts, good to see you alive and kicking!

3) A hybrid solution, wherein large parts of the old map that we don't care about can be completely replaced with new terrain. It would probably be more work than the other options, though.

Yes, this is the solution I'd like as well as I don't wish to see the map reset either.

Not sure how re-generating such large areas would work out in the end - but I'm not afraid to try either.
Would require pin-pointing existing homes and buildings and of course a backup, should anything have been removed in error.

As for plugins, a lack of protective ones could be disastrous. Anyone who builds more than a dirt hut wants it to be safe from griefing assholes. Even if a rollback could simply undo the damage, in the meantime you'd have a ruined area and basically nothing to build on/toward. With so many Minecraft servers available, those without the patience to deal with preventable shenanigans would leave or never join in the first place. Having only a whitelist won't help much, I'm afraid.

Valid point - and I enjoy Towny, it's has great functionality and protects players belongings well.
I have a few wishes regarding the configuration - but we'll see about that at a latter point.

It's worthwhile to start the discussion early, but I'll need to wait and see what develops before making any solid recommendations. It's all speculation at this point.

Yes, the update is scheduled to be released on Wednesday I believe and a server update is most likely not happening before 1-2 weeks after the release regardless.

When I moved over to Anembra (when I got tired of the frequent resets of modded Minecraft), I started slowly building but I was burned when the old map was lost. Since then I have had a hard time trusting to commit to the current map... with that I understand that people like to keep the current map, and if I would have spent more than a few hours on the current one so would I.

Aye, I as well would keep a reset as a very, very last resort.

I do like the idea of pure vanilla with no plugins, one fun thing with the old map was the railroad network, I love these things. Nether hubs and transport systems are also fun to build but they are pointless with teleports. But I agree, griefers are a problem w/o plugins.

With some more time on my hands - I'd definitely love bringing back a proper railroad system spanning through the landscape!

Is managing spigot/bukkit plugins time consuming these days? Is it Spigot that you like to avoid? Are you looking for hosted options?

Well, not really time-consuming but there's a definite trend in much less frequents updates of the various plugins and many are becoming obsolete.
Spigot works pretty much splendidly and they still update fairly quickly (major updates/releases 1-2 weeks tops after an official release).

[Är du fortfarande Svensk? Livet rullar på?]

Vinden är ännu med mig här på svensk mark, allt grönt! Hur är det själv din gamle filur?!

 

[dannyboykey]

Hey there Knas! Over the summer I've been spending a bit more time on the server and would hate for it to be nuked. Correct me if I'm wrong, I thought the design of the mine world was to gather resources and explore stuff, whereas the main world is more for building and creation, biomes become pretty obsolete when it comes to building. Since the mine world is reset every month don't the new features in 1.13 spawn in the mine world? Whats the point of updating the main world for these updates if its intention is for building? If possible, my suggestion would be to increase the mine world map size for exploring (you really can't go too far now) and enjoying these new features.

I also vote yes for the rail system!

 

[Hybrid Warrior]

I'm fine with transferring old structures to a new map, My entire build is on an island so as long as there is an ocean or similar biome I'm fine with a soft reboot. Regenerating terrain on the current map for unused areas would require some testing off server since I think world gen is different with the new update, so chunk errors might occur but nothing too weird I think. and I think using rail systems again would be fantastic, It makes gameplay all that more interactive and fun.

 

[Kapten_Knas]

It definitely sounds like the map is enjoyed in it current state - so the idea of a nuke can be ignored at least, which is great to hear!
In that case a partial re-generation is the most viable solution (if needed of course).
Copying existing buildings will most likely be a lot more work than regenerating unused chunks.

If possible, my suggestion would be to increase the mine world map size for exploring (you really can't go too far now) and enjoying these new features.

Hm, that's a bit odd though as the current limit is a radius of 4000 blocks (6k main)..?
Does it feel too cramped atm?

 

[Kapten_Knas]

I also vote yes for the rail system!

Already gathering resources.

 

[nsgb]

What is the current status of the Nether? Is that still considered a resource world? If we are going to run w/o teleporters I think the nether is needed for transport.

Vinden är ännu med mig här på svensk mark, allt grönt! Hur är det själv din gamle filur?!

Låter bra! Jovars, saker rullar på och faller på plats, första dagen på semestern i dag!

 

[J1015814]

I feel less bad about procrastinating so hard on the rail system It'll really be something once the dust settles.

 

[Kapten_Knas]

What is the current status of the Nether? Is that still considered a resource world? If we are going to run w/o teleporters I think the nether is needed for transport.

Yes, the Nether still resets along w/ the End and Mineworld at the moment.

I'm a bit split regarding the teleports, it limits the creativity of travelling and encourages larger projects such as a nether hub and/or train system.
Though it also provides a way for newer players to get to each other, especially considering the random teleportation.
Without the random teleportation on the other hand, people would bunch up right around spawn as we've seen earlier...

 

[Hybrid Warrior]

I think it's important to still have the random teleportation when player start to avoid bunching, but aside from that I think teleports just make the unused portions of the map stale since nobody bothers going through it when traveling.

If we decide to regen unused portions of the map, I'd recommend testing it on a copy of the map since I think they significantly altered the way terrain is generated, we may encounter a lot of chunk mish mash

 

[Kapten_Knas]

If we decide to regen unused portions of the map, I'd recommend testing it on a copy of the map since I think they significantly altered the way terrain is generated, we may encounter a lot of chunk mish mash

Of course, I'm seeing if I can put a copy of the entire server on a different machine/IP to see the changes ingame and backend before the main server receives an update.

 

[Hybrid Warrior]

Sweet!

 

[J1015814]

There are parts of the main world where the trees got sliced and are missing several blocks. Almost as if they caught fire, but not as destructively. I'm guessing this is a side-effect of the version conversion, or importing, or whatever it's called. Hopefully there's a way to fix that, otherwise the wilderness is gonna look funky.

 

[Kapten_Knas]

There are parts of the main world where the trees got sliced and are missing several blocks. Almost as if they caught fire, but not as destructively. I'm guessing this is a side-effect of the version conversion, or importing, or whatever it's called. Hopefully there's a way to fix that, otherwise the wilderness is gonna look funky.

Alright! Do you happen to have any coordinates?

 

[J1015814]

I only noticed two spots, one in my town and the other just outside it, but I can't log in at this moment to see if it's a more widespread phenomenon. Maybe it's just from my recent rollback activities.

 

[Kapten_Knas]

Maybe it's just from my recent rollback activities.

Definitely sounds related, let me know if you find any spots and I'll have a look.
Server's accessible again - a bit of firewall shenanigans.

 

[J1015814]

I've noticed a few outside other towns, but so far nothing in the wilderness. Should be manageable.

Edited to add: it looks like a plugin is contributing to this anomaly. If you chop a tree at its base with an axe (punching does not make it happen) it falls over and drops logs and planted saplings. It doesn't always work, presumably because the plugin determines the tree is still supported somehow. When falling, it's highly likely to tear down leaves from nearby trees.

 

[J1015814]

I just ran a few tests. Going back to version 1.9.4, terrain generation appears to be largely unchanged so long as the world seed is the same. In what version was the current main world map made? It might be worthwhile to regenerate it in 1.14+ and copy-paste our stuff into it.